CJ Flagpole Rejected (Fellow Bloggers Unite!!) BUMP w/ AUDIO!!
September 14th, 2006 by CJ
BUMP!! I'm bumping this up for a couple of reasons. The first is that I want to make sure that you all read the comments of some of the people who have called the association or management. The stories are incredible. Second, I wanted to share with you my experience as a soldier when I called.
Initially, I called Frank DeCoster. I've called a few times and left messages on the machine. I explained I was a soldier and wanted to know why I was fighting for a flag they wouldn't allow residents to ahve the freedom to fly. As you can guess, my calls were never returned. I called again tonight and Frank's wife answered the phone. I asked in he was home and then introduced myself. She told me that he wasn't home and asked if he could return my call. I said sure and she asked me if he would know what the call was about. I responded that I was a soldier and was calling to speak about the HOA.
"Is this about the flag thing?" she asked me.
"Yeeup," was my simple response. There was an audible exhale of air and she told me that she'd relay the message and have him call me back. That was about 2 hours ago.
So, I began to work my way down the list. Next in line was Steve McSmith, the VP for the Homeowner's Association. Steve answered the phone and introduced myself. I told him I was a soldier stationed on the east coast and wanted to know why we were being sent out to defend a flag he wouldn't allow to fly freely in his community. His response that they DID allow the flag the flag and, in fact, it was flying at the very moment of the phone call. I explained that it wasn't flying "in a free manner". He then told me to "get [my] facts straight and keep [my] nose out of business that didn't concern" me. I responded that it does concern me because I'm risking my life for that flag. Was he honestly telling me that the flag has NOTHING to do with a soldier? I never got an answer. He hung up on me.
You can listen to (or download) the short conversation yourself HERE. Again, this is Steve McSmith, VP of the Homeowner's Association in Franklin, TN.
How hard do you think it would be to raise about $3000 to help Michael Beckett sue these guys? He didn't ask, it's something I'm tossing out there for thoughts. I've already got $150 pledged if I do something like this.
On July 24, 2006, President Bush made this statement as he signed into law the Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005:
Americans have long flown our flag at their homes as an expression of their appreciation for our freedoms and their pride in our Nation. As our brave men and women continue to fight to protect our country overseas, Congress has passed an important measure to protect our citizens' right to express their patriotism here at home without burdensome restrictions.
However, Michael Beckett, who I met through this site when I wrote THIS post after the act was passed, was recently forced to, again, take down his American flag (watch the video HERE). He had recently put it back up for the first time since September 2002, when he was forced to take it down.
This was a flag that was given to him by a soldier in Afghanistan. The flag accompanied Army SGT Tony Pinto throughout his entire tour and was then given to Michael. The flag is currently framed in the traditional triangular wooden box in his home.
"We have no problem with him displaying the American flag," Decoster said, "but the problem is with the flag pole. We feel that flag poles, especially outside flag poles, are an obstruction."
However, according to the act itself, "[Homeowner's Associations] may not adopt or enforce any policy, or enter into any agreement, that would RESTRICT or PREVENT a member of the association from displaying the flag of the United States on residential property within the association." [emphasis added]
The Act also says, "Nothing in this Act shall be considered to permit any display or use that is inconsistent with…any reasonable restriction pertaining to the time, place, or manner of displaying the flag of the United States." The evil, communistic HOAs in Tennessee have translated that to mean they can still do what they want.
There is nothing "obstructive" about a flagpole that is no more than two inches wide. Michael's yard if a half acre wide!! That's approximately 960 inches wide and these people are complaining that almost two inches is "obstructive. The flag was being flown high enough that it didn't obstruct the view of the house from the road, or the road from the house. It wasn't ordained with gawdy symbols, shapes or designs. The definition of obstruction is "something that blocks or closes up with an obstacle or obstacles; obstacle or hindrance." I doubt even Decoster's pencil neck would be obstructed. It was a standard flag pole. And yet, this HOA has bastardized the Act passed by Senate, Congress, and President.
The problem here is that the general populace of the neighborhood doesn't support the HOA's stance with regard to this issue. The Board is elected, but because the population of about 4,000 people has more important things to do like earning a living and feeding their family's, only about 100 people usually show up to the meetings and elections for these people. The President and his Board are all retired and take turns at the mantle. Outside of their little click, they are thought of as "freaks" and "idiots", according to conversations I had with some residents (yes, I'm a research nerd).
Michael Beckett put up that flag in the days after 9/11, 2001. By November, he was already fighting to keep it up. Now, five years later, the HOA's haven't learned anything about freedom and the blood it takes to keep it. Instead, they pay groups like CAI (Community Associations Institute) who lobby Congress to pass bills like this one that defeat themselves. It's absurd that in one paragraph it says that there will be no "restrictions" or "preventions" to flying a flag and then just two paragraphs later imposing restrictions. They say they support the freedom to fly the flag but only HOA's "are best suited to determine the appropriate size, placement and installation of a flag pole" and reject any state laws attempting to give us back our true freedom.
The Representative of this area, Tennessee's 7th District, is a woman named Marsha Blackburn (who, by the way, is a staunch supporter of the military and our efforts in the war against terrorism). Her office phone number is 202-225-2811. You can't send an email because you have to live in her district. But, you can call her.
The management, however, could use your phone calls and directed anger. The management company hired by the HOA is Morris Property Management Company. Linda Ivey is the manager and can be reached at 615-833-5117 x 29.
The HOA President, Frank Decoster, can be reached at
63 Alton Park Ln,
Franklin, TN 37069-4333
(615) 794-2963
Here are the rest of the board members' numbers:
Steve McSmith – Vice President
3024 Burlington Pass
Franklin, TN 37069-1898
(615) 591-1378
John Beaudoin – Secretary
217 Greystone Dr
Franklin, TN 37069-4305
(615) 794-6617
Jenny Foerster – Communications Committee
701 Blackhorse Pkwy
Franklin, TN 37069-6534
Jim Clohessy – Member
305 Saddlebridge Ln
Franklin, TN 37069-4318
(615) 790-1795
(615) 599-3127
Fellow readers and bloggers. Please pass this along to as many people as possible. We can sign petitions all day long and it'll do little good. Call these individuals and demand that they change the rules to allow flagpoles, which is what almost ALL flags are flown from. Tell them that you will boycott the management company and refuse to take any vacations in the area until they do. Or use your own statements, you don't have to use mine. Email this story to your local news and all national media outlets to bring visibility to this.
If you have a blog, please copy this post and let as many people as possible know that there are still Americans being prevented from flying the flag in their front yard. I am personally offended that I'm being sent off to defend a flag that the citizens I'm protecting can't even fly. It mocks the very freedom that those stars and stripes represent.
This makes me so angry that I am prompted to use words that would make my mother wash my mouth out with soap.
What is wrong with these people?
This is just NOT right. You can bet I'll be writing letters to those people. Like Flag Gazer, it makes me angry and tempts me to say some things that aren't very nice or ladylike.
grrrrrrr…. I emailed this to about a gazillion people!!!!!!! Grrr… that is sooo wrong!
Here is an email I got from one person that wrote me what happened when they called:
"I just called the manager of the homeowners' association there where Mr. Beckett lives…what a jerk! She kept going back to "if everyone in our development put up a flagpole…" "it's unfortunate this resulted in several lawsuits and tied up the court system…"
I told her we also live in a development governed by a homeowners' association and I thank God they don't exhibit such rules as this. I told her it's not like everyone in the community there wanted to erect a flagpole in their front yard, and they could have easily passed a "grandfather clause" where no more could be erected and when he passed away or moved, the flagpole would be removed.
She want on and on and on and I finally hung up on her! I have no time for such thick-headed people."
CJ, the link to the bill you posted was dead. I went ahead and changed it to a working link.
And that is pretty crappy. The HOA shouldn't be able to regulate the flying of a flag.
Where is the ACLU on this one, huh?
This crazy woman (link) can do as she pleases, but when it comes down to our flag…
PS, sorry about the url but I wasn't sure if I could do html in here.
Cpl M adds and then changes it back and then fixes the problem: Yes, you can do HTML, CL. I went ahead and made it a link for you.
Stupid WP bug. Whenever there is a " or ' it throws a / in there. You can probably tell because I didn't put a / with the two marks when I edited this comment. Sorry, folks. I need to look into that and see if there is a way to fix it.WP bug squashed.OMG LL!!!!! That was totally infuriating!
The very reason that I would never buy a property under the control of a HOA. One never knows what “Nazi-Moon Bat-Petty Control Freak is going to be imposing their self styled since of relevancy or values on you in an entirely inappropriate manner. The only thing to do in a situation such as this is to go on the attack by finding what ever minor and insignificant “rule� that the offenders are transgressing, (certainly there will be one or two) and sue them for it. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.
PS. Sorry for the “knee jerk,� but this just has me PO’ed. I didn’t realize that Tennessee was Moon Bat Central.
I just don't understand this P.C. mentality. Good men and, women are dying to enable simple rights such as this. The Left Wing Leadership is creating such kos over The Patriot Act claiming that we (" Are Losing Our Civil Rights.") And They Won't let a U.S. Citizen Fly Our Nations Flag on Thier Own Property? The HOA management team Should just admit that they are ENEMY COMBATANTS, aganst this nation, our flag, our president, including our goverment, the soldiers which who are fighting, the people and, all that it stands for.
My friend from Soldiers' Angels, who is British and a Canadian resident, called Mr. DeCoster, the HOA President, personally herself today! She emailed me this and said to make sure to share it!
*hehehe* YAY for her!
=============================
Have to share this with you – and figured you might wanna FLASH it large.
I just called Mr Frank DeCoster… the talk went something like this:
"Hello is that Mr Frank Decoster? "
"Yes."
"Good morning. I am calling from Canada in the hope that you will set straight a rumour that has made it up here".
"All the way from Canada huh?"
"Yep…..and I hear that some Americans are not allowed to fly your country's flag. Is that true?"
"No not all all…don't know where you heard this".
"You ARE Mr Frank Decoster of the HOA?"
"Yes I am the president of the HOA."
"Okay good…so you are absolutely telling me that EVERY American is free to fly their flag wherever they like?""
"Yes."
"Phew I am soooo relieved Mr DeCoster..can I quote you on that?"
"Sure"….
"Thank you so much Mr decoster. You have a great day now".
loud laughter from me…off the phone of course.
And no of course I didnt tape this…..didnt need to…
BUT FLY YOUR FLAGS AMERICA!!!! Mr DeCoster says ya can……NEXT!!!
Happy to help ya all over there…..
I'm spreading the word ~ linking to you.
[...] Read the rest here. [...]
Mr. Decoster failed to mention that you can fly the flag… but only the way they say you can. Not here… not there… but maybe over there if you ask permission and they say it's OK.
Dear Readers,
I am in California and I went through the exact same situation and won!
Thanks to Michael Beckett who made me aware of the new federal law protecting my right to fly the American Flag anyway I choose and I chose a flag pole in my front yard. I called every person mentioned above including the Tennessee 7th District's Representative, Marsha Blackburn, mentioned in your 10th Paragraph above. The President told me he appreciated my opinion and the Secretary asked me if I was aware that Mr.Beckett has been displaying his flag for over five years. I told him that he was kept by their HOA from "FLYING" the American Flag and that his right is protected by law. He said maybe I should read the law more carefully and I said, I have an attorney who interpreted the law and we fought the HOA here in CA. and won and that maybe he should get an attorney to interpret the law for him, because he is definitely twisting the law to fit his needs and I hung up. I think we should all contribute to help Mr. Beckett get an attorney to fight this. It probably wouldn't take more than $3,000 to get started. I was lucky as it only cost me $300 for my attorney to write a letter. I must say that all the phone calls and emails to the HOA on my behalf helped alot as well as the newspaper and TV News coverage I received. If the owner of this website or Mr. Beckett wants to manage the money I will personally contribute $100. I may be reached at RebeccaAnnOwens@msn.com. Mr. Beckett needs to get a high profile attorney and get as much exposure as possible. Call the major networks like Fox as well as the local newspapers and TV news Station. They like stories like this on slow news days. I did my part by calling all the people above and I think anyone reading this needs to do the same! Help a fellow American. We must not let the liberals continue to take away our civil rights one at a time, because if we do, one day we are going to wake up and no longer be free! God Bless America!!!!!
Ya think maybe Steve-baby needs a call from Canada? Hmmmmm… maybe he hasnt heard what Frankie said earlier today….and to be so rude to you? Maybe he needs a lesson in civility and manners….."and a reminder – the world is watching"…lol
this is so absurd. These people must not approve of the job our soldiers are performing for our FREEDOM. Maybe some day they will realize just what the flag is a symbol of. If they were in jail they would want the right of freedom, if they had any feelings for their country at all, that rule could be changed with a short little meeting of their HOA. It is beautiful to fly the flag from the pole. Maybe they are jealous because they can't erect a pole in their yard due to TREES that OBSTRUCT it's view. HUH HUH HUH. Maybe that is the whole object, they are JEALOUS because theycan't have one so no other homes are allowed. Look at that aspect of their yards and the way it is positioned.
First of all the ACLU would back the HOA and not the individual person. Second, I would suffest that he display his flag on an attached pole to his house. HOA boards are some of the most radical people in the world or they would not be on those boards. Most of them have "axes" to grind about one thing or another and in most cases are completely absurd. I think a patition circulated throughout the community would be appropriate and were over 50% of the residents signing IN FAVOR would be the first step to get his removed from the court system. I would wonder what "obsrtuction" the flag pole would cause. Unless the pole in the airport control zone and tall enough to be a hazzard, then it can be lighted on top, I am sure it not an obstruction to birds flying around, and cars should not be in the man's yard and "HOW" can a pole deprive you of visual accuity.
It appears to me that the HOA should shutup and find some things that are a real problem in the area that need their attention, and I AM SURE THERE ARE MANY THAT NEED CORRECTION AND NOT A FLAG POLE WITH AN AMERICAN FLAG ON TOP OF IT. It would be interesting to know the background of the HOA board members background and find out their REAL reason for their actions. I am very sure you would find it person rather than 'OBSTRUCITON RELATED".
Anything new going on with this?
I just passed this story on to "Purple House on the Net". They publish HOA horror stories like this one. I hope it helps.
I cannot believe these people! The reason why so many people emmigrate here is because of the ineniable (hope the spellings correct) rights and freedoms we have unlike any other place in the world, and for a few people to decide that we should not have the right to fly a flag on a pole because it is obstructive!!! Where can I begin! Soldiers are dying in Irag everyday so that we can remain free, and allowing the residents to fly their flag proudly is the LEAST they can do to say thank you to those soldiers. And lets not even go into how the HOA is breaking a law signed by the President himself! Those living in the community should not allow these people to get away with this. Fight until you win, that is the only way we will retain our God given freedoms.